並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/%E9%9D%92%E6%99%A8%E6%9C%89%E7%B4%84-15-%E6%8A%80%E6%93%8A%E9%A4%A8%E9%81%8B%E5%8B%95%E5%A0%B4-%E5%AF%B6%E5%8F%AF%E5%A4%A2%E5%A4%A7%E5%B8%AB%E7%9A%AE%E5%8D%A1-0625/id1575840701?i=1000528312320