並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/de/podcast/ep80-%E5%8F%B0%E7%81%A3%E8%BC%AA%E6%A4%85%E7%B1%83%E7%90%83%E5%B8%82%E5%A0%B4%E5%B0%8F-%E5%BF%83%E7%90%86%E6%B4%BE%E6%95%99%E7%B7%B4-%E8%94%A1%E7%90%AA%E6%8F%9A/id1481973949?i=1000519000685